By Steve Johnson
Late 1997. I was a 22-year-old kid who had just gone to work for a guy named Wayne Holt at Hornady Manufacturing. I had completed two summer internships prior to being hired full time. My first full-time project was to reshoot data and update the “5th Edition Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading.” At night. After production shut down in the ballistics lab. Hornady was a different company in the late 1990s … the “good old days” in my opinion.
In the spring of 1998, Wayne threw me a little side project. We were just over a year into the introduction of the TAP ammunition line. Wayne had hired a gentleman to collect data for our marketing and to put together the Hornady Academy Carbine and Precision Rifle classes. That gentleman was Giles Stock. Over the following years, I worked my ass off to earn the title of “Range Bitch” and on a few special occasions “the son I never wanted.” Giles and I made, and shot, A LOT of ballistic gel over the years. Giles and Wayne remain on my short list of good friends, and it took me years to realize just how damn lucky I was to be mixed up with guys like them, among others, in my formative years. To me, they were always just Giles and Wayne. With that in mind, I wanted to ask Giles less about Scout Rifle specifications and more about the philosophy that gave birth to Scout Rifles.
For anyone unfamiliar with Giles Stock, I included a brief bio at the end of the write up, but the part of Giles’ resume that is germane to our Scout Rifle discussion condenses to this: Giles was a Gunsite instructor and rangemaster for 30+ years and worked closely with Jeff Cooper over that time on projects to include the Scout Rifle project. I was picking Giles’ brain on the phone a few weeks ago to sharpen up for my Scout build and he agreed to do a little Q&A with me to offer his perspective on Scout Rifles and Jeff Cooper.
Q&A With Gunsite Legend Giles Stock
Q: What parameters of the Scout Rifle were non-negotiable?
A: The Scout Rifle is a “hunting-centric” design that is ideal for any game. Four-legged or two-legged; your choice. Length should be around 1 meter; however, Jeff did allow for barrels a bit longer if the rifle was chambered in 243. Which he recommended for recoil sensitive shooters. Whatever the length, the rifle should remain light and handy for making one GOOD shot very quickly. If a great rifle was an inch or two over a meter … it was still a great rifle, but it needs to be close to a meter.
Weight—ideally in the 3 to 3.5 kg range, but Jeff also believed that the rifle should not be so heavy that it cannot be held in one hand, at arm’s length. If it cannot be held this way, it needs to be lighter. Some may need a lighter rifle than 3 kg; some shooters may be able to handle 3.5+kg without issue; but it should be “light.”
Action type. Short action, bolt action only. Period. Short action because it is a quicker bolt throw, and the action is the balance point. The scope being mounted forward of the action made it easier to carry and load. With regard to magazines, there were no good detachable box magazine options for bolt-action rifles available at that time, but had there been, they would have likely been Jeff’s preference. Jeff was thrilled when Steyr used detachable box magazines on their Scout rifle. He did like the magazine shut off on the O3A3 Springfield bolt action, as the magazine could be shut off and the rifle could be hand fed, but Scout Rifles are bolt actions plain and simple. Bolt actions can be used anywhere in the world without issue; that is not the case for semi-autos.
Scopes and sights. Jeff was skeptical of optics in general. He came from a generation where good iron sights were the standard on all battle rifles. He had also witnessed the evolution of sporting scopes from their inception. He favored a simple, fixed, low-magnification scope with a heavy-duplex reticle. He likely would have been very skeptical of variable magnification scopes. Both the Leupold and Burris fixed-power scopes at the time that held up well, but Jeff was always somewhat skeptical of scopes in general.
LPVO-type optics would have been “out” simply because of speed of target acquisition. The intermediate eye relief, low-magnification scope allows the shooter to make a very quick shot with both eyes open. He would have also been very skeptical of any type of red dots sights as well, even if they have a great track record. Because batteries die.
Q: How locked in on specific cartridges was Cooper?
A: Jeff was most fond of the .308 for general purpose work, but he didn’t seem to be an absolutist about the chambering—7mm-08 and .243 were fine too. “Fireplug H,” a .350 Remington Magnum in the 660 Mohawk was another favorite of Jeff’s, and the 660 Mohawk is the first factory rifle that really intrigued him. He had a Scout built on the 660 Mohawk platform and had ammo loaded for it. He wanted a 250-grain bullet at 2,500 fps from the muzzle. The brass could not be reloaded after one firing. Jeff was thrilled with the .376 Steyr 270-grain load at 2,550 fps, although he was not as fond of the 225-grain bullet loaded at the same velocity. Jeff was adamantly opposed to the .223 Remington in general.
Q: How about bipods? Were they an absolute, or more of an optional thing?
A: Jeff really liked having a bipod on the Scout Rifle, but he liked a taller bipod for getting over the weeds or for shooting from a sitting position on a log, etc. Brent Clifton built bipods into his stocks, which were the predecessor to the Stery Scout bipod. The Clifton bipods were adequate, a bit flimsy, but they worked. Bipods were also used as “kick stands” around camp.
Q: What were Jeff’s thoughts on bolt handle shape?
A: We all initially liked the “ping-pong ball” bolt knob best, however Jeff changed his preference to the butter knife bolt handle and stuck with that for the long haul. It was lower profile and would go in and out of scabbards more easily.
Q: Did Jeff have any strong feelings about triggers, safety mechanisms— two- or three-position safety, ideal trigger “pull” weight, etc?
A: Jeff liked triggers in the 2-2.5lb range. Some of the safeties out there are a little flimsy. The Steyr SBS system is excellent; Remington is adequate. The real safety is keeping your finger off the trigger.
Q: I have always associated the Ching Sling with the Scout rifle. Is that rooted in historical fact or is that my imagination?
A: The CW Sling was modified into the Ching Sling. Bruce Nelson made the early slings to Eric Ching’s design. CW Sling needed to be modified to allow for shoulder carry. The original sling was made for Jeff, who was older at the time, and it was modified to suit other shooters as well.
Q: Do you believe any of Jeff’s perspectives on Scout Rifles would have changed based on new rifles, actions, barrels, optics or other components that are available today but did not exist in the past?
A: Absolutely. BUT. It would HAVE TO have fit the original parameters, period.
Q: Was there ever a Scout Rifle that Jeff considered the “ideal” or “archetypal” example? If so, can I find it online to research further?
A: “Sweetheart” was THE quintessential Scout Rifle by Jeff’s standard until Steyr introduced their Scout Rifle. Jeff and the Steyr Scout became very close. Janell (Jeff’s wife) said that Jeff carried his Steyr Scout around like Linus carried his blanket in the cartoon “Peanuts.”
Q: Wrapping up— anything you would add to the Scout Rifle discussion given your proximity to the original development of the platform?
A: Rifles were always special to Jeff. We did a lot of handgun training at Gunsite and did it well. That said, when it came time for rifle classes, Jeff was different. There was a spring in his step and his level of enthusiasm was elevated. The Scout Rifle was special to Jeff, and the Scout Rifle concept is still very relevant. The Steyr Scout is the best version of the Scout Rifle that has been produced. Leupold should bring back the original fixed-power Scout scopes. It is better to keep it simple with a fixed-power scope. If you cannot see the animal, don’t take the shot. Magnification can help you see better; it cannot help you shoot better.
Many people do not understand the features of the Steyr Scout. I personally would not try and build any custom Scout Rifle today, as the Steyr Scout does it better out of the box. The Steyr Scout is all the Scout that anyone needs; it’s only missing the Leupold scope.
Cooper’s Scout Endures
After talking with Giles and reading Jeff’s articles on the Scout Rifle and others, I believe the Scout Rifle concept does have some non-negotiable elements, but they all seem to be focused on the Scout Rifle’s ability to do Scout Rifle things. As long as the rifle is a compact, light, capable, quick, short-action bolt action that is deadass reliable; it seems to fit the parameters of the Scout Rifle that Cooper laid out over 40 years ago. I question whether it is worth splitting hairs beyond that; Jeff’s exploration and establishment of the Scout Rifle concept seemed to leave room for learning and improvement. If you google Jeff Cooper’s “Sweetheart,” which was described by Giles as Jeff’s favorite Scout Rifle prior to the introduction of the Steyr Scout, you’ll see that Sweetheart is missing iron sights and was noted by Jeff to be about 3/4-pound overweight. Sweetheart is a Scout Rifle. Sweetheart was Jeff Cooper’s Scout Rifle.
I’ve known Giles a long time. What I have come to understand about Giles is that when he tells me something, I can take it to the bank. When we discussed the Scout Rifle concept and how it came to be, the only hard and fast things were short-action bolt-action rifles with fixed-power/low-magnification/intermediate eye relief scopes, that are light, quick, accurate and handy. They are intended for a capable man to quickly put accurate rounds on a target in a variety of situations with a cartridge capable enough to “do work.” There are many ways to get to that end state, and it is going to be cool to see what the Field Ethos Society guys brings to the range.
Giles Stock
To attempt to summarize Giles’ career and contributions to the firearms culture in a few paragraphs would require a better writer than myself. Giles spent more than three decades as a Gunsite instructor and rangemaster, served with Phoenix Police Department in a variety of capacities, and helped to shape Hornady Academy’s early training programs, developed the Giles Tactical Sling, among other tools, and worked alongside Jeff Cooper during the Scout Rifle project time period.
Those accomplishments are impressive, but they are not why I asked Giles for more information and insight on Scout Rifles. I wanted to interview him to share the perspective of someone who was there at the inception of the Scout Rifle concept. And, most importantly, having known Giles for nearly 30 years, I have learned first-hand, when Giles tells me something about rifles or shooting, I don’t need a second opinion.
For more on the legendary Jeff Cooper and his lasting impact on firearms, training and badassery in general, visit the Jeff Cooper Legacy Foundation.
